Gunfighter

M.W. · Joined: 12 Jul 2007 Posts: 134 Location: inside the loop

This is a single purpose shotgun concept that I have been working with for nearly a year now. Dale has helped me and as usual I hope others on this forum will contribute insights,tell me if I'm wrong,all opinions welcome, and help us keep learning.

At a gun show in January, I saw a box of the Aguila Mini-shell 12ga. rounds and was intrigued by the 1 3/4" LE/Military short shell idea.

**Not to start any debates,I myself like the Benelli M-4 semi-auto, Remington 870,Mossbergs are OK, full charge kick-b*tt tactical ammo,and all that Warrior stuff but hear me out,think it through,research the links, and maybe,just maybe this set up could have a good fit with your own family home defense planning**

The givens and premises:

1) There are two sounds in this country that will cause the person(s) hearing them to instantly freeze and rethink carefully what they are about to do next.
The first is the tail-rattling of a Diamondback Rattlesnake and the other is the racking of a pump-shotgun...hold that thought.

2) You,the awesome Combat Master,may not be around the house when an attack occurs. Daytime kick-door invasions are more frequent and your spouse/teenage kid may be there to face them without you.

3) What weapon could we choose for them that has plenty of stopping power,is reliable,simple to operate and aim,has fewer wall over-penetration problems,won't kick the cr*p out of the less practiced person using it,has fast follow-up shots, commands respect from intruders AND has enough shell capacity if needed? Hmmm,well a shotgun of course except maybe the heavy recoil/enough rounds part...assume worse case scenario please folks, blind panic shooting,little ability to manipulate a reload under stress,total fear,etc.

Enter my hero...the venerable Winchester Model 1300 Defender 18" or 20" barrel 12ga. pump-shotgun ..woohoo! http://www.winchesterguns.com/prodinfo/catalog/historic_detail.asp?cat_id=512&type_id=104&cat=012C
This is the ONLY gun that will function the Mini-shells flawlessly without minor gunsmithing work. http://www.aguilaammo.com/minishells_shotgun_mods.htm
Another good part of the Defender is that I can use the standard 2 3/4" and 3" shells as needed too. I will do a post on those other loads later.
Get one or two while they are available, I have two and my kid has one in North Carolina.
(No chuckling please,you can still pick them up for $225 - $325 with wood stocks/forends. We replace those with lighter synthetic,add a Dale Hunnicutt grip texturing job www.gripreductions.com -and shorten the stock per the Hoffner shotgun combat stance)

The findings:

We can now load 12 rounds of the Aguila Buckshot Mini-shells (4)1B + (7)4B= 11Pellets/1200fps or (10-11 rnds if you mix in the 875 grain/1250fps Mini-Slugs) and all the mini-shells have very little recoil too...
http://www.aguilaammo.com/minishells.htm
... and still keep the weapon in Vehicle-ready mode,chamber empty/safety off in a dedicated spot in the home. All the spouse/young adult has to do is get to the gun,rack the slide (which can be heard all over most houses),point and shoot. Any intruders,after the wife cranks off a half dozen shots, is either dead,dying rapidly,or has already split the area and she still has 5-6 rounds in reserve in the tube magazine...I'll go with those odds any day.

Conclusion:
Having a "family defense gun" (like a loyal guard dog pet) that everyone can practice with,stands ready at a moments notice, and that they will not be physically afraid to use has to be worth considering.

Semper_Fi · Joined: 08 Jul 2007 Posts: 399 Location: Jakarta, Indonesia

M.W.,
Your 12 gauge 1-3/4" mini-shell logic is on the money and makes sense for home defense. 1-3/4" shells have very low recoil and a Winchester 1300 Defender has been in our home for many years. Winchester 1300's are inexpensive and widely available.

Perhaps this weapon/ammo combination can be showcased at our next American Defenders training session where the Warrior faithful can fire a 1-3/4" round or two. I can bring gear if Hoff approves.

Note to Hoff and shotgun instructors - M.W. is on to something here....the 1-3/4" shell / 1300 Defender combination is excellent for women and minors and may be worth highlighting in training sessions to the public.

In Houston, Jim Pruett carries 12 gauge 1-3/4" mini-shells.

M.W. · Joined: 12 Jul 2007 Posts: 134 Location: inside the loop

Thanks Semper, it's just another arrow in a Warrior Sheepdog's quiver of defense ideas.

Never know,maybe those beautiful mother and daughter victims up in Pennsylvania might be alive today if a weapon like the Defender was available to them against the two escaped prisoners we heard about a couple of months ago.

DEMON · Joined: 13 Jul 2007 Posts: 186 Location: Houston,Texas

Why not simply go to a 20ga.Just a thought. Twisted Evil

M.W. · Joined: 12 Jul 2007 Posts: 134 Location: inside the loop

I thought about that too,Demon and of course that is a good option.

Even the 20ga. will kick more though and not hold as many rounds in the tube. What turned me on was that I can get so many initially without having to force a reload.

Tac · Joined: 02 Sep 2007 Posts: 40 Location: Arizona

I actually have two loaded shotguns in the house... One in the bedroom is a Winchester 1300 Defender, as pictured, with the addition of ghost ring rear/night sight front sights. It stays near the bed were either me or the wife can access it. It is loaded with 00 buck and has a spare shell carrier loaded with slugs.

The other shotgun is a 18 inch rifle sighted Remington 870 that is loaded with slugs and resides in a built in concealment "cabinet" that is part of a coat rack near my front door. This shotgun is equiped with a telescoping AR style stock and is the only one that will fit in this "cabinet". I load it with slug, under the premise that it is close to the front door, and if taken outside, the slug will give me more range and better penetration if needed against vehicle barriers.

My wife is comfortable with the use of the Winchester and asked me to keep it in the bedroom.....

I can attest to the "thought provoking sound" a pump shotgun makes when racked to chamber a round.

A few years back, I was working graveyard shift and had left my swat gear in my office at home after a long day training, and being in a hurry to get to work. I only live about a mile outside my beat area at the time, and thought it would be no big deal to run home and grab my gear if I needed it..... Well, Mr. Murphy stepped in, and guess what? We ended up getting a call out on a barricated person... I ran home, only to discover that I had left my garage door opener in my truck and my only means into the house was through the front door. (We always use the garage door, and my wife can generally sleep through it, knowing that it's me coming home... the front door has a security screen door that creeks when you open it, and makes a noise that is very distinct. I never use this door, and my wife knows this.)

Long story short, it's 2 AM, I don't want to call and wake my wife, as she has to be up early, and figure I wil just "sneek in" grab my gear and go.....

About two steps inside the house, I hear the distinct sound of that 1300 being racked with considerable force! I then hear, "Honey-that better be you!" coming from the master bedroom! I froze! I then immediately identified myself, apologized and peeked around the corner to see my wife, in a position of cover, with that shotgun covering the bedroom door, phone next to her on the bed and a very upset look on her face! (I was so proud! Shocked

)

After additional groveling for forgiveness on my part, and an additional explination, I grabbed my gear and headed for the call out.... Safe in the knowledge that my wife could defend the home front until I could return.

M.W. · Joined: 12 Jul 2007 Posts: 134 Location: inside the loop

Wow,Tac..awesome example of pre-planning for home defense.

Sounds like you had about 2 seconds to identify yourself or she was going to cut loose with that Defender maybe right through the walls which a 12ga. can easily do. Perfect tactical position for her,too.

The male lion's role is protector of the Pride,but the lioness is nothing to mess with either.

Semper_Fi · Joined: 08 Jul 2007 Posts: 399 Location: Jakarta, Indonesia

Every family and home in America should be trained and equipped like yours Tac.

fm2 · Joined: 16 Jul 2007 Posts: 67

Semper_Fi · Joined: 08 Jul 2007 Posts: 399 Location: Jakarta, Indonesia

I'd estimate that the 12 gauge 1-3/4" mini-shell generates 20% - 25% less recoil than the #4 buck loads I use.

Another advantage of the 1-3/4" mini-shell is that nine (9) rounds fit into the Winchester 1300 tube.